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Thread: Upgrading from x10 to CBUS

  1. #1
    Automated Home Guru Wexfordman's Avatar
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    Default Upgrading from x10 to CBUS

    Hi,

    Have had x10 in my house for about 7 years now, all DIN rail modules. My house is a bungalow, so pleny of access to run cat5 or whatever down to the existing switches.

    I am considering, replacing X10 and going for CBUS, just looking for peoples opnion, and an idea of what would be invovled on the rewire side, particularly the ac rewiring of the DIN modules.

    Might start doing it bit by bit if its feasible. I have comfort already, gen1, so might need to upgrade that also, as well as new UCM etc, but my main concern before I go for it, is how easy.difficult it is to change wiring from X10din modules to Clipsal ?

    Regards,
    Eamon

  2. #2
    Automated Home Guru FrankMcAlinden's Avatar
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    Hi Eamon

    If you have all your x10 din modules located in the same place then that part of the upgrade should be easy....Although you need to make enough space for the cbus dimmer modules if still leaving some x10 modules in place...Its the wiring of the switches that will be a pain as you need to get some cat5 cable to them......

    Frank
    Home of FirM - the Multi Zone IR Transport System
    http://www.armaghelectrical.com.au/index.html

  3. #3
    Automated Home Guru Wexfordman's Avatar
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    Default Access to switches

    Hi Frank,

    Thanks for the reply. With regards to getting CAT 5 to my switches, it should be easy enough, my house is a bungalow, so I will have access to the trunking from the attic down to each switch.

    If I go ahead with it, the cbus, hw will go to the same point as the x10 din modules, or I could gradually "migrate" then to a new consumer unit positioned next to them. Just need to work out space and no of units etc.

    So I take it the wiring of the AC side will be straight forward enough, in that I pull ot the live going to the switch, and connect load from the X10 din module, to the load of my cbus module ?

    I have 18 din modules which would be replaced, so this might be pricey, hence the staged approach. Also, I will probabvly need to upgrade comfort as well, as I have a gen 1 panel. Have a Homevision unit too, so not sure how well that will integrate, or if its even worth keeping ?


    Regards,
    Eamon
    Last edited by Wexfordman; 9th February 2008 at 08:34 PM.

  4. #4
    Automated Home Legend chris_j_hunter's Avatar
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    Eamon -

    sounds to me (dare I say it here) Idratek might also fit your situation quite well, and might be quite affordable ... there's an AH forum, too, like this one, which might be worth a quick visit, at least ...

    Chris

  5. #5
    Automated Home Legend chris_j_hunter's Avatar
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    Eamon -

    meant to say, too, that it uses Cat-5, so that part would be much the same, & would be easy in that it would work by replacing some of your DIN units & wall-switches, that it has an X-10 gateway, so transfer could be phased, cost-& time-wise, keeping eveything working as you go ... you could even retain some of the old stuff more permantently ...

    anyway, just a thought !

    Chris

  6. #6
    Automated Home Guru FrankMcAlinden's Avatar
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    Hi Eamon

    When you say pull out the live going to the switch i assume this is connected to the manual input of the x10 Module (LD11..??) if so yes it doesnt get used... It may be difficult to do a gradual change over unless you have lots of room as i assume you,ll use an 8 channel 1 amp dimmer which is approx 220mm long (8..3/4 inches)......so i would approach it with the intent of changing 8 lights in one hit.......

    Im controlling my CBUS Lighting + CBUS Audio using Homevision ;-) .... Custom lighting support was added a while back (new prom required) ..You would require a Clipsal pc interface and a spare HV serial port and apply online for clipsals basic protocol (need to sign a N.D.A) THen one macro and some variables and your off and running....So you can use Homevision to control both CBUS and x10.....Theres also device available from Kevin H a Homevision user which takes a lot of the hard work out tracking the CBUS loads...I got one on my bench connected to my test HV Unit ..So i wouldnt dispose of your HV unit..
    http://www.ukusa.demon.co.uk/HVCBUS.htm

    HTH
    Frank

    PS.....Are you Eamon O,G...???


    Quote Originally Posted by Wexfordman View Post
    Hi Frank,

    Thanks for the reply. With regards to getting CAT 5 to my switches, it should be easy enough, my house is a bungalow, so I will have access to the trunking from the attic down to each switch.

    If I go ahead with it, the cbus, hw will go to the same point as the x10 din modules, or I could gradually "migrate" then to a new consumer unit positioned next to them. Just need to work out space and no of units etc.

    So I take it the wiring of the AC side will be straight forward enough, in that I pull ot the live going to the switch, and connect load from the X10 din module, to the load of my cbus module ?

    I have 18 din modules which would be replaced, so this might be pricey, hence the staged approach. Also, I will probabvly need to upgrade comfort as well, as I have a gen 1 panel. Have a Homevision unit too, so not sure how well that will integrate, or if its even worth keeping ?


    Regards,
    Eamon
    Home of FirM - the Multi Zone IR Transport System
    http://www.armaghelectrical.com.au/index.html

  7. #7
    Automated Home Guru Wexfordman's Avatar
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    Hi Frank,

    Thanks for the reply. Yes, I am Eamon O'G !! I've been sussed :-)

    Good news abot the homevision, while I would not be too upset getting rid of x10 (although I have no complaints about it), I'm a bit attatched to my HV !!.

    My consumer units have 4 x10 modules in each row, not sure how wide that is, but I could probably replace the 4 x10 with 8 CBUS, must get out the tape measure this evening to check.

    Regards,
    Eamon

  8. #8
    Automated Home Lurker
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    Hi Eamon
    I have a c-bus system here in wexford, work in progress still,and will be for years:-) if I can help you any way let me know, I have one of Kevin's homevision to cbus gateways on it's way to me at the moment also to have a play with. Also doing a bit of playing with CQC which alows me to control my russound with cbus.

    Dave

  9. #9
    Automated Home Guru MichaelD's Avatar
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    Eamon,

    I'm replacing X10 with C-Bus2, and it is proving to be absolutely solid reliability, the DLT switches and scenes, and scene transitions all look high-end fabulous, in fact almost all the C-Bus switches look good, so the end result is everything I'd hoped for.

    The transition is the challenging part, for me the main points are:

    - Running C-Bus2 mains-insulated Cat5e into every switch point is messy, but OK. There is no conduit to the switches in my house, so I've had to channel the wall to put in new cable, then cut off the mains cable. I've chosen US/AUS sized switches, I think they look better, so have had to put in a different box.

    - The Cat5e connections don't have to go back to a central point, they can be star configuration, daisy-chained, or just cut into the middle of an existing run and crimp things together, its really easy.

    - The mains looks like it will be OK for you. Standard C-Bus2 dimmers and relays are 215mm wide, AD10s are 35mm, LD11s are 80mm, so you can work our how things will fit, but remember that a C-Bus2 units come as 4 x 2A, 8 x 1A dimmers, or up to 12 relays 10A. So if you've mixed ADs and LDs then you'll have to plan their replacement very carefully, and be careful about those loads.

    - Once you start to put in C-Bus, you'll want to get rid of X10 as fast as possible. I'm aiming to keep just a few modules, like the screen/shutter control module

    If you want some C-Bus switches, let me know, I bought up the entire stock from SimplyAutomate with the intention of deploying them in my home, then selling the surplus on ebay. Otherwise this stuff can be really expensive!

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