Comms fault - Hot Water - Actuation

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  • jonstatt
    Automated Home Guru
    • Feb 2015
    • 111

    Comms fault - Hot Water - Actuation

    After a month of running perfectly, I started to get erratic comms fault errors in the log on the controller. Although it says "Hot Water", I don't think it is the actual Hot Water BDR91 at all. This is because the times of day it is reporting the problems are not the times the hot water is even on! With an S-plan set-up, I believe both BDR91s actually appear as "Hot Water" unfortunately. Reception for both BDR91s is always 5/5. The heating BDR91 is about 15 feet away from the controller on the wall where the thermostat used to be so there is nothing to interfere with it.

    Anyway, I couldn't figure out what was causing this, so I just pulled the power from the BDP91 for heating, and it has been fine ever since I reconnected it with no more comms fault errors. I am a bit suspicious about this BDR91 though because it is making a high pitched noise at all times (one of those really high pitched sounds that not everyone can hear and only if I put my ear close to it).

    For now I am leaving everything alone as the power reset seems to have cured it.....anyone else experienced this?
  • top brake
    Automated Home Legend
    • Feb 2015
    • 837

    #2
    sounds like the relays are too close to each other/incorrectly bound

    pics first please
    I work for Resideo, posts are personal and my own views.

    Comment

    • jonstatt
      Automated Home Guru
      • Feb 2015
      • 111

      #3
      Originally posted by top brake View Post
      sounds like the relays are too close to each other/incorrectly bound

      pics first please
      The two relays are on different floors of the house, so they are definitely not too close. I will sort out some pics later!

      Comment

      • top brake
        Automated Home Legend
        • Feb 2015
        • 837

        #4
        Originally posted by jonstatt View Post
        The two relays are on different floors of the house, so they are definitely not too close. I will sort out some pics later!
        be good to see how close/far from other sources of interference/shielding

        what process did you follow to add the hot water kit?
        I work for Resideo, posts are personal and my own views.

        Comment

        • jonstatt
          Automated Home Guru
          • Feb 2015
          • 111

          #5
          Originally posted by top brake View Post
          be good to see how close/far from other sources of interference/shielding

          what process did you follow to add the hot water kit?

          I can only give a rough outline of what I did because I can't recall the exact order things happen

          I removed the boiler relay first in the controller (set to none)

          Then I used the Sundial valves - Stored Hot Water option, s-plan set-up

          I think the first thing I bound was the thermal sensor for the water tank

          I then factory reset the "real" hot water relay by holding down the BDR91 button for 15 seconds and then bound the relay with the controller

          It then asked me to add the heating relay, so I held that BDR91 button for 15 seconds and then it bound that relay with the controller


          As I said earlier it has been working fine for a month. Both relays are operating independently and correctly for heating and hot water respectively.

          When I thought it was the Hot Water BDR91, I actually pulled it out of the airing cupboard completely on it's wires and had it "in the open" with nothing around it, but the faults still appeared. Then I tried power resetting the mains power to the heating one after I realised it must be that one instead, and it has been fine ever since.

          Here are the pictures:-




          P.S You may be wondering why I didn't mount the HW BDR91 on the left wall of the airing cupboard. Simply, the Mrs like's to hang damp clothes etc in there to dry out and I didn't want the risk of the BDR91 getting wet. As I mentioned above though, I pulled it right out of the cupboard into a completely open space away from anything and it didn't make any difference ....and it isn't this BDR91 causing the errors anyway. The hallway one is the one with the high pitched sound coming from it
          Last edited by jonstatt; 23 March 2015, 05:08 PM.

          Comment

          • sharpener
            Automated Home Sr Member
            • Jan 2015
            • 78

            #6
            Is that a dimmer switch below the heating relay and do the wires to it run up inside the wall behind it?

            Comment

            • jonstatt
              Automated Home Guru
              • Feb 2015
              • 111

              #7
              Originally posted by sharpener View Post
              Is that a dimmer switch below the heating relay and do the wires to it run up inside the wall behind it?
              It's just a push on/off , not dimmer. The wires probably do run up the same channel. But some of the faults happened in the middle of the night, like at 1am when the lights were off anyway so although there would be a live connection on one side of the switch, no current would be flowing.

              Comment

              • top brake
                Automated Home Legend
                • Feb 2015
                • 837

                #8
                Originally posted by jonstatt View Post
                I can only give a rough outline of what I did because I can't recall the exact order things happen

                I removed the boiler relay first in the controller (set to none)

                Then I used the Sundial valves - Stored Hot Water option, s-plan set-up

                I think the first thing I bound was the thermal sensor for the water tank

                I then factory reset the "real" hot water relay by holding down the BDR91 button for 15 seconds and then bound the relay with the controller

                It then asked me to add the heating relay, so I held that BDR91 button for 15 seconds and then it bound that relay with the controller


                As I said earlier it has been working fine for a month. Both relays are operating independently and correctly for heating and hot water respectively.

                When I thought it was the Hot Water BDR91, I actually pulled it out of the airing cupboard completely on it's wires and had it "in the open" with nothing around it, but the faults still appeared. Then I tried power resetting the mains power to the heating one after I realised it must be that one instead, and it has been fine ever since.

                Here are the pictures:-




                P.S You may be wondering why I didn't mount the HW BDR91 on the left wall of the airing cupboard. Simply, the Mrs like's to hang damp clothes etc in there to dry out and I didn't want the risk of the BDR91 getting wet. As I mentioned above though, I pulled it right out of the cupboard into a completely open space away from anything and it didn't make any difference ....and it isn't this BDR91 causing the errors anyway. The hallway one is the one with the high pitched sound coming from it

                please locate the Hot water BDR91 away from those metal pipes, minimum 300mm

                where is the Hot water sensor/transceiver?

                picture of evohome fault log please
                I work for Resideo, posts are personal and my own views.

                Comment

                • jonstatt
                  Automated Home Guru
                  • Feb 2015
                  • 111

                  #9
                  Originally posted by top brake View Post
                  please locate the Hot water BDR91 away from those metal pipes, minimum 300mm

                  where is the Hot water sensor/transceiver?
                  I knew you were going to say that and that was my first thought, which is why I ran the BDR91 outside of the cupboard completely for a couple of days but it didn't make any difference...........and remember that I power reset the heating one, and since then the problems have gone (for now).

                  The hot water sensor/transceiver is mounted about 2.5 feet below the BDR91.

                  Signal level tests always show 5 whatever and whenever I try it.

                  Comment

                  • The EVOHOME Shop
                    Site Sponsor
                    • Dec 2014
                    • 483

                    #10
                    Originally posted by jonstatt View Post
                    It's just a push on/off , not dimmer. The wires probably do run up the same channel. But some of the faults happened in the middle of the night, like at 1am when the lights were off anyway so although there would be a live connection on one side of the switch, no current would be flowing.
                    Is there a metal back box behind the heating BDR91 or is it just a stud wall? As good practice I would be locating the hot water BDR91 right at the top of the cupboard away from those copper (metal) pipes and the cylinder itself. I am not ruling out the possibility of a faulty heating BDR91 but you need to try these things out first otherwise you end up replacing BDR91's just for the sake of it.

                    Comment

                    • jonstatt
                      Automated Home Guru
                      • Feb 2015
                      • 111

                      #11
                      Originally posted by The EVOHOME Shop View Post
                      Is there a metal back box behind the heating BDR91 or is it just a stud wall? As good practice I would be locating the hot water BDR91 right at the top of the cupboard away from those copper (metal) pipes and the cylinder itself. I am not ruling out the possibility of a faulty heating BDR91 but you need to try these things out first otherwise you end up replacing BDR91's just for the sake of it.
                      Yes I understand and appreciate that. I am not rushing to change anything at this point. The heating BDR91 has no metal back box, it is just a stud wall and directly replaced the previous thermostat.

                      Comment

                      • top brake
                        Automated Home Legend
                        • Feb 2015
                        • 837

                        #12
                        Originally posted by jonstatt View Post
                        I knew you were going to say that and that was my first thought, which is why I ran the BDR91 outside of the cupboard completely for a couple of days but it didn't make any difference...........and remember that I power reset the heating one, and since then the problems have gone (for now).

                        The hot water sensor/transceiver is mounted about 2.5 feet below the BDR91.

                        Signal level tests always show 5 whatever and whenever I try it.
                        as i suggested, double binding...
                        I work for Resideo, posts are personal and my own views.

                        Comment

                        • jonstatt
                          Automated Home Guru
                          • Feb 2015
                          • 111

                          #13
                          Originally posted by top brake View Post
                          as i suggested, double binding...
                          How can that be? I factory reset both BDR91s and removed the boiler relay (and even removed the batteries from the controller to reset it). How can there be a double binding if it has worked correctly for a month? Also wouldn't I see the heating relay come on when the hot water is on or vice versa....which I am not.

                          Comment

                          • top brake
                            Automated Home Legend
                            • Feb 2015
                            • 837

                            #14
                            Originally posted by jonstatt View Post
                            How can that be? I factory reset both BDR91s and removed the heating relay (and even removed the batteries from the controller to reset it). How can there be a double binding if it has worked correctly for a month? Also wouldn't I see the heating relay come on when the hot water is on or vice versa....which I am not.
                            so you are saying that you did a subsequent rebind on just the heating relay
                            I work for Resideo, posts are personal and my own views.

                            Comment

                            • jonstatt
                              Automated Home Guru
                              • Feb 2015
                              • 111

                              #15
                              Originally posted by top brake View Post
                              so you are saying that you did a subsequent rebind on just the heating relay
                              I typed too quickly and went back to edit my post. I meant when I first installed the hot water kit, I removed the boiler relay (and removed the battery from the controller)....and I factory reset both BDR91s by holding down the button for 15 seconds. I also made sure that the heating relay only comes on when heat is being asked for, and the hot water one only comes on when hot water is asked for. They are not coming on when they shouldn't.

                              Comment

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