Heating my tower rails which don't have radiator controls during the warm months

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  • bruce_miranda
    Automated Home Legend
    • Jul 2014
    • 2307

    Heating my tower rails which don't have radiator controls during the warm months

    Previously I used to run the CH on my old timer and just used the evohome and the radiator controllers as smart TRVs. Now having moved to OpenTherm, my boiler is fired by the Evohome based on actual radiator demand, rather than time. Since the temperature has gone up none of the radiators call for heat and so the towel rails ran cold.

    To overcome this, I used the evohome's internal thermostat but with no accuator paired during the pairing process to a new zone. I now use this 'dummy' zone to fire the boiler when I need it, and since all the other zones are shut, it only heats the towel rails.

    Just thought I'll put this idea out there.

    You could extend this idea to heat any radiators without radiator controllers, if you wanted.
  • top brake
    Automated Home Legend
    • Feb 2015
    • 837

    #2
    Originally posted by bruce_miranda View Post
    Previously I used to run the CH on my old timer and just used the evohome and the radiator controllers as smart TRVs. Now having moved to OpenTherm, my boiler is fired by the Evohome based on actual radiator demand, rather than time. Since the temperature has gone up none of the radiators call for heat and so the towel rails ran cold.

    To overcome this, I used the evohome's internal thermostat but with no accuator paired during the pairing process to a new zone. I now use this 'dummy' zone to fire the boiler when I need it, and since all the other zones are shut, it only heats the towel rails.

    Just thought I'll put this idea out there.

    You could extend this idea to heat any radiators without radiator controllers, if you wanted.
    Hmm I think this will generate system error. Not recommended
    I work for Resideo, posts are personal and my own views.

    Comment

    • bruce_miranda
      Automated Home Legend
      • Jul 2014
      • 2307

      #3
      If you are referring to some internal fault then maybe, but there arent any faults showing up on the fault log.

      Comment

      • JohnnyP
        Automated Home Jr Member
        • Nov 2008
        • 38

        #4
        Over the summer, I reduce the flow temperature in the radiators to luke warm via a 3-way mixing valve on the boiler, and set a single zone to heat to an unattainably high temperature for a couple of periods during the day. This fires the boiler and produces hot water and hot towel rails. I'm on Hometronic though...and have never used Optimisation (which wouldn't like this kind of fiddling).

        Comment

        • sandyman
          Automated Home Sr Member
          • Mar 2016
          • 85

          #5
          Originally posted by bruce_miranda View Post
          Previously I used to run the CH on my old timer and just used the evohome and the radiator controllers as smart TRVs. Now having moved to OpenTherm, my boiler is fired by the Evohome based on actual radiator demand, rather than time. Since the temperature has gone up none of the radiators call for heat and so the towel rails ran cold.

          To overcome this, I used the evohome's internal thermostat but with no accuator paired during the pairing process to a new zone. I now use this 'dummy' zone to fire the boiler when I need it, and since all the other zones are shut, it only heats the towel rails.

          Just thought I'll put this idea out there.

          You could extend this idea to heat any radiators without radiator controllers, if you wanted.
          did you do any maths on the efficiency of this versus using electric summer elements in the towel rails . I have electric 150w summer elements along with HR92 on my 2x towel rads. the elec elements are on approx 3 hrs a day. The CH is completely off at this point. 150w *3 hrs * 10p/kwh - about 4.5p a day per rad?

          Comment

          • Storks
            Automated Home Lurker
            • Sep 2016
            • 1

            #6
            Originally posted by JohnnyP View Post
            Over the summer, I started taking the Best Diet Pills to reduce the flow temperature in the radiators to luke warm via a 3-way mixing valve on the boiler, and set a single zone to heat to an unattainably high temperature for a couple of periods during the day. This fires the boiler and produces hot water and hot towel rails. I'm on Hometronic though...and have never used Optimisation (which wouldn't like this kind of fiddling).
            Where did you get your mixing valve?
            Last edited by Storks; 6 March 2020, 10:27 AM.

            Comment

            • FullBore
              Automated Home Guru
              • Jan 2016
              • 140

              #7
              Sandyman you wrote:-

              I have electric 150w summer elements along with HR92 on my 2x towel rads. the elec elements are on approx 3 hrs a day. The CH is completely off at this point. 150w *3 hrs * 10p/kwh - about 4.5p a day per rad?
              I fear this is probably a stupid question - but have you managed to control your summer electric elements with Evohome - if so that would be great.

              FB

              Comment

              • Rameses
                Industry Expert
                • Nov 2014
                • 446

                #8
                Originally posted by FullBore View Post
                Sandyman you wrote:-



                I fear this is probably a stupid question - but have you managed to control your summer electric elements with Evohome - if so that would be great.

                FB
                If you draw less than 1100w then the bdr91 can be used.
                getconnected.honeywell.com | I work for Honeywell. Any posts I make are purely to help if I can. Any personal views expressed are my own

                Comment

                • DBMandrake
                  Automated Home Legend
                  • Sep 2014
                  • 2361

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Rameses View Post
                  If you draw less than 1100w then the bdr91 can be used.
                  But.... it will still cause the boiler to fire when only the electric element needs heat, correct ? In which case no, you can't use it practically speaking, unless you want your boiler heating up your automatic bypass loop for no good reason...

                  An option for an electric element zone type (that doesn't fire the boiler or heating zone relays) in a future update would be gratefully received of course!
                  Last edited by DBMandrake; 23 September 2016, 08:54 AM.

                  Comment

                  • Rameses
                    Industry Expert
                    • Nov 2014
                    • 446

                    #10
                    Originally posted by DBMandrake View Post
                    But.... it will still cause the boiler to fire when only the electric element needs heat, correct ? In which case no, you can't use it practically speaking, unless you want your boiler heating up your automatic bypass loop for no good reason...

                    An option for an electric element zone type (that doesn't fire the boiler or heating zone relays) in a future update would be gratefully received of course!

                    DMB is correct - sorry I should have mentioned. For me it is rare I have an electric need and the boiler not needing to fire, but yes this (currently) a limitation, same with the load limit - Standby ;-)
                    getconnected.honeywell.com | I work for Honeywell. Any posts I make are purely to help if I can. Any personal views expressed are my own

                    Comment

                    • DBMandrake
                      Automated Home Legend
                      • Sep 2014
                      • 2361

                      #11
                      Standing by.

                      I have a perfect use case for an electric zone - our kitchen backs onto an interior "porch" that has washing machine, boiler closet and then the real back door off it.

                      The room is somewhat like a conservatory and is not heated, (except by a tiny amount of heat trickling through the vents in the boiler closet door) not particularly well insulated as it has clear skylight for roof and large window areas. It also has concrete floor and concrete walls on two sides, so while it's not far from the boiler its impractical to "neatly" install a radiator in that room without exposed piping all the way around the wall.

                      And if I was to install a radiator in that un-insulated room, the very radiator that I am adding to help avoid freezing is now itself vulnerable to freezing unless it always has frost protection enabled. As its the worst insulated room in the house its the most likely to freeze first if the heating is off when people are away.

                      A wall mounted electric heater with a wireless relay could be easily and neatly installed along with a DTS92. As well as providing some heating for that room when desired (it is sometimes used for clothes drying etc) it could provide frost protection for the room (and the boiler mounted in the cupboard in the room) without itself being vulnerable to freezing.

                      Comment

                      • The EVOHOME Shop
                        Site Sponsor
                        • Dec 2014
                        • 483

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Rameses View Post
                        DMB is correct - sorry I should have mentioned. For me it is rare I have an electric need and the boiler not needing to fire, but yes this (currently) a limitation, same with the load limit - Standby ;-)
                        Is this the same 'Standby' as external temp suggested some time ago? Maybe you can give me some insight at some point Rameses?

                        Comment

                        • FullBore
                          Automated Home Guru
                          • Jan 2016
                          • 140

                          #13
                          I would love to be able to add up to 4 or 5 electric zones, for small rooms which have no "water" central heating, or heating of bathrooms (both underfloor & electric towel rails) in summer.

                          Fingers crossed.

                          FB

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