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Thread: EvoHome programming multiple HR92's to a zone...

  1. #1
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    Default EvoHome programming multiple HR92's to a zone...

    Hi, and thanks for adding me.

    I'm struggling loads with the installation of evohome... I'm struggling with the switching of the boiler...

    so in the interest of complete disclosure, I might have been a little too exited on day 1 and gone through the installation without properly reading the instructions, but as a man, I think this should have been expected.


    I have 28 rads including 4 towel rails in the house. I have set up 11 zones, and as an example, My living room has 4 rads in it.. I set everything up on friday and the boiler was switching on when I set the demand on one or all of the zones, but wouldn't switch off again. Even if I pressed manual override off, it would switch back on again after about a minute.

    After reading many posts and advice here and on other pages... I did what I beleive to be a complete and factory reset on all devices to start the installation process from scratch... I reset the wireless receiver, I did a factory reset on the control box and took batteries out for half an hour, and I unbound all of the TRVs and did what i read is a reset, by going to main menu and going to 12, pressing the function button over to 0, changing the 0 to 1, then going to exit. (it doesn't feel like this does anything I'm sure there is a missing step here). Then I followed the instructions to the letter... here is what happens.

    I set up only the living room with one TVR bound to living room zone. I set the temperature of this TRV to 30, and the receiver light switches on to green, and the boiler fires up.
    I set the TRV to 15, and the Green light switches off, and the boiler shuts down.
    Repeat sever times with the same result. Perfect... So I believe I proved the wiring etc is correct, because it all acts as expected. I believe the TRV is communicating fine, because all acts as expected.


    The problem arises when I bind in the other three Rads in the living room. I follow the instructions to now bind them in. I put all three to binding, then I go to settings, zone configuration, and living room. Then I click on RF Devices and press the green button on the screen. I get a success message and the other three TRVs now say living room. I believe this is then setting the valves up to mimic what the frist valve does, as the first valve will act as the master and only use this thermostat. ... I get a message saying 4 bound 2 ways.

    I then set the temp to 30, and all 4 TRVs go to 30. Whatever I do manually or through the programmer, all 4 valves in the living room react the same. When I ask for the temperature to increase... The green light lights on the receiver, and the boiler fires up.

    Now I set the temp to 15 on my mater TRV, or through the controller, and all the rads wind down to 15... but the green light remains on the receiver, and the boiler remains on. If I manually override it the boiler switches off and the light goes out... but then 1 minute later it switches back on again. Ive left it for over an hour, understanding that sometimes the message might not be received, and I believe it resends every 4 minutes, so I left it, and all I did was cook everyone in the living room.. There doesn't appear to ever be a signal to shut the boiler off.

    I tried a complete reset about 5 times over this weekend and every time I get the same results. It works with one, but the minute I add the other three, it fails. I might add that I tried binding 1 extra TRV at a time, and it seemed to work with three, but the 4th made it fail. So I treid doing it in a different order, trying to see if one of the valves might be faulty... but I don't think this is the issue. Again, my understanding is that nothing should really change in the communications, since even with 3 extra bound in, the communication to the switch is from the 1st valve, and this works on its own.
    I tried to unbind one at a time but it only works once I unbind all three and just leave the original one bound, then switch off the wireless receiver manually and it finally switches off and stays off... then it will work in control again on the one valve.

    I'm literally out of ideas.. please help.

  2. #2
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    UPDATE. OK so I think I've made some headway. I have it all kind of working, but realise that the Boiler demand is staying on because it is reporting that the some valves are still open when they are closed.

    So I decided to check the TRV valves, and when I wind them manually down to closed, they do start to get quite tight. So I have loosened the fitting on the valve, making sure that I can get it to the closed and open position fairly easily. does this sound like I'm on the right track? I assume the communications are all fine because the valves read the correct values, but to clear the demand issue I have to remove the had and slightly tighten the valve manually and it seems to go from 100% to 0.

    If there are any installers in the Leeds, Wakefield area then please let me know and ill pay for your expertise, as this is proper doing my head in now.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rwdicky View Post
    I have 28 rads including 4 towel rails in the house. I have set up 11 zones, and as an example, My living room has 4 rads in it.. I set everything up on friday and the boiler was switching on when I set the demand on one or all of the zones, but wouldn't switch off again. Even if I pressed manual override off, it would switch back on again after about a minute.
    "Manual override off", I assume you mean the Heating Off quick action ?

    What you need to understand about how the system works is that it's effectively the individual HR92's that call for heat from the boiler (relayed through the controller to the relay) not the controller itself directly.

    When you make any set point change via the controller or phone app (this includes the heating off action) this must first be sent to the HR92's before anything happens. This doesn't happen immediately, and can take up to about 4 minutes.

    So the sequence of events is:

    1) You put the controller into Heating Off mode. Nothing happens immediately. The boiler relay will continue to follow it's previous on/off cycle for a while.
    2) Some "random" time in the next 4 minutes the controller will send out messages to all the affected HR92's to tell them their set points are now 5 degrees, or whatever temp you have heating "off" configured to.
    3) The HR92's all turn their motors to push down the pin and close the valves. This can take about 30 seconds or so from fully open to fully closed.
    4) NOW all the HR92's send new heat demands of zero to the controller to indicate they don't require any heat from the boiler. When all the heat demands from all HR92's are zero then a zero heat demand will be sent to the boiler relay and finally the boiler will go off. It only takes one HR92 to still be calling for heat for the boiler to stay on as any HR92 can call for heat.

    If you're expecting the heating off action to immediately turn off the boiler you'll be disappointed, and this misunderstanding may explain some of what you think to be the system not working properly.
    After reading many posts and advice here and on other pages... I did what I beleive to be a complete and factory reset on all devices to start the installation process from scratch... I reset the wireless receiver, I did a factory reset on the control box and took batteries out for half an hour, and I unbound all of the TRVs and did what i read is a reset, by going to main menu and going to 12, pressing the function button over to 0, changing the 0 to 1, then going to exit. (it doesn't feel like this does anything I'm sure there is a missing step here). Then I followed the instructions to the letter... here is what happens.
    Using option 12 only resets the values of the other numbered options to their defaults, it doesn't clear the binding. To clear the binding you go into the binding mode and instead of a quick press to bind you do a long press to unbind. It's not clear whether you did this or not.
    The problem arises when I bind in the other three Rads in the living room. I follow the instructions to now bind them in. I put all three to binding, then I go to settings, zone configuration, and living room. Then I click on RF Devices and press the green button on the screen. I get a success message and the other three TRVs now say living room. I believe this is then setting the valves up to mimic what the frist valve does, as the first valve will act as the master and only use this thermostat. ... I get a message saying 4 bound 2 ways.
    As long as the room is the default of "single room zone" then there is one master TRV for the zone that measures the temperature (the first one) and the rest will be slaves which go by the temperature measurement from the master TRV, which is relayed to them via the controller.
    I then set the temp to 30, and all 4 TRVs go to 30. Whatever I do manually or through the programmer, all 4 valves in the living room react the same. When I ask for the temperature to increase... The green light lights on the receiver, and the boiler fires up.

    Now I set the temp to 15 on my mater TRV, or through the controller, and all the rads wind down to 15... but the green light remains on the receiver, and the boiler remains on. If I manually override it the boiler switches off and the light goes out... but then 1 minute later it switches back on again. Ive left it for over an hour, understanding that sometimes the message might not be received, and I believe it resends every 4 minutes, so I left it, and all I did was cook everyone in the living room.. There doesn't appear to ever be a signal to shut the boiler off.
    First I would check in the installer menu system devices to see whether a zone really is reporting a non zero heat demand.

    Also, the heat demand sent to the boiler failing to turn off shouldn't cause everyone in the living room to "cook" - that suggests that one of the TRV's was not in fact dropping it's set point. Did you confirm the set point on every TRV in the zone had in fact dropped to 15 degrees and that this is at least 2 degrees lower than the actual temperature of the room ?

    If they have updated to the new set point but the radiator is still hot after a while then that suggests that the HR92 is not closing the valve properly - perhaps a seizing up or not fully compatible valve. Sometimes setting Stroke to 1 in the HR92 config can help with stubborn valves.

    I tried a complete reset about 5 times over this weekend and every time I get the same results. It works with one, but the minute I add the other three, it fails. I might add that I tried binding 1 extra TRV at a time, and it seemed to work with three, but the 4th made it fail. So I treid doing it in a different order, trying to see if one of the valves might be faulty... but I don't think this is the issue. Again, my understanding is that nothing should really change in the communications, since even with 3 extra bound in, the communication to the switch is from the 1st valve, and this works on its own.
    I tried to unbind one at a time but it only works once I unbind all three and just leave the original one bound, then switch off the wireless receiver manually and it finally switches off and stays off... then it will work in control again on the one valve.
    A multi-TRV zone is a little complicated so I'll try to explain how it works behind the scenes. This applies to the "single room zone" mode only, which is the default.

    The first TRV you bind becomes the temperature sensor and subsequent devices are slaves. Periodically (depends how quickly the temperature is changing) this first HR92 sends a temperature reading to the controller and then every 4 minutes the controller sends this temperature reading back out to all TRV's in the zone - including the one that originally sent it. This relayed temperature reading is the one displayed on the HR92 screens if you have room temperature display enabled.

    Each TRV uses this same measured temperature and the set point to decide how much to open the valve on the radiator to hit the target set point. After a valve position change is made a new "heat demand" is sent back to the controller. The heat demand is basically just the valve position. Every TRV in the zone will send its own heat demand to the controller however as they are going by the same temperature reading and set point the heat demands will be about the same.

    The controller gathers the heat demands of ALL the TRV's in the house from all zones, takes the highest figure and sends that to the boiler relay.

    If you change the set point at the controller, some time within 4 minutes the new set point will be sent to all TRV's in that zone.

    if you change the set point at a TRV, that TRV will change set point immediately and inform the controller within a few seconds, both of the change in set point and the change in heat demand, however the remaining HR92's in the zone will not be informed for up to four minutes. So if you turn down a TRV manually in a multi-TRV zone then the heat demand from the zone will not stop immediately because it takes time for the other HR92's in the zone to be informed of the change, just as it does when you change the set point from the controller.

    Make sense ?
    Last edited by DBMandrake; 17th September 2019 at 11:30 AM.

  4. #4
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    Firstly DBMandrake, thank you for a full and thorough reply.

    I did do a full and thorough reset on everything, including unbinding and resetting, sorry iwas not clear on this.

    So where I am today.

    I am definitely missing the feedback from the valve. The Process I am following is as follows.

    Set the heating of all zones to come on at 30. it takes a few minutes, but eventually all valves move and heating come on. All valve read 30 physically.

    Wait five minutes.

    Cancel the heat all rooms to 30. All rooms then drop to 15. Wait a few minutes. All valves go down to and report 15 locally.

    wait 5 minutes... light on relay is still lit.

    press and hold settings menu to get to installers menu, and click on system summary.

    find one, two, sometimes three zones still asking for 100%, wireless relay is at 100%. its never on 70%, 50%, 15%... it on 100%. Wait a further 10 minutes, still not working. Try to send another signal to the zone/s set at 100% to go down to 5 deg, valve reading says 5 a minute or so later.. valve winds down, but system summary still says 100%. Radiator cools... definitely no flow at all to other rad in this zone, zone still says 100% demand. As I say... its definitely doing what its supposed to be at the valve end, its the receiver that's misbehaving.. in actual fact the boiler ramps right down, if I didn't have towel rails I wouldn't know there was even a problem, but its just not working as it should and I cant figure why. Do I need to boost the signal or What? Its sometimes the same zone, but not always, it does differ and sometimes its a few zones. Some of the zones are close to the relay, some are upstairs, some are downstairs.... It isn't the same pattern at all.

    I love the versatility of the system, the functionality that's available and everything that it says it does.. I did loads of research I thought on the best product to go with, but sadly I think its going to end up re-boxed and returned.

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