Boiler to go with EvoHome?

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  • slicendice73
    Automated Home Lurker
    • Sep 2019
    • 4

    Boiler to go with EvoHome?

    I have an old 30kW boiler that's on its last legs and needs replacing so I've been looking round for suitable models. I also need to have the ability to set different temperatures in different rooms of the house at various times of days so I want to get EvoHome installed as well.

    I was originally looking at Vaillant but then discovered they don't support OpenTherm...and (from what I understand) whilst this doesn't mean it's impossible to use a Vaillant with EvoHome, it's better if the boiler does support OpenTherm.

    I've had Intergas recommended (as it works well with EvoHome and the boilers themselves are supposed to be pretty good) and one installer also recommended a Baxi 830.

    Just wondering what boilers other EvoHome users have? Any recommendations as to what (or what not!) to get?

    Thanks
  • Somebody
    Automated Home Sr Member
    • Feb 2019
    • 79

    #2
    The system you have will also impact on whether to go OpenTherm. If you have a S or Y plan system - have a look at this (registration required): http://theevohomeshopforum.co.uk/vie...440c36b2e8e4b4

    Comment

    • paulockenden
      Automated Home Legend
      • Apr 2015
      • 1719

      #3
      I went for Intergas (got the Eco RF model).

      Plays perfectly with Evohome, and I love the fact that the internal design is so simple (OK, maybe the electronics less so). Why invest in something that's going to be dead within 5-10 years like most modern boilers?

      Comment

      • slicendice73
        Automated Home Lurker
        • Sep 2019
        • 4

        #4
        Originally posted by paulockenden View Post
        I went for Intergas (got the Eco RF model).

        Plays perfectly with Evohome, and I love the fact that the internal design is so simple (OK, maybe the electronics less so). Why invest in something that's going to be dead within 5-10 years like most modern boilers?
        Thanks Paul. Just out of interest, what was it that swung you to the Eco RF over the Xtreme or Xclusive?

        Comment

        • paulockenden
          Automated Home Legend
          • Apr 2015
          • 1719

          #5
          I think the Eco range is supposed to be quieter than the X models, and some of the X models have a shorter warranty. The Eco is also a bit smaller.

          Basically, I went for the tried and tested model. The Xes had only just come out when I bought. But I think the X models have a better modulation range, which might be appealing with Evohome/Opentherm. So swings and roundabouts...

          Comment

          • slicendice73
            Automated Home Lurker
            • Sep 2019
            • 4

            #6
            Originally posted by paulockenden View Post
            I think the Eco range is supposed to be quieter than the X models, and some of the X models have a shorter warranty. The Eco is also a bit smaller.

            Basically, I went for the tried and tested model. The Xes had only just come out when I bought. But I think the X models have a better modulation range, which might be appealing with Evohome/Opentherm. So swings and roundabouts...
            Ok, thanks...makes sense. I believe the Xclusive is basically the Xtreme but without the Passive Flue Gas Heat Recovery thingy whatsit (I'm such a pro! ;-)

            Quite tempted by the Xclusive...noise isn't really a massive issue for me as it would be in the loft. I do like the minimal moving parts inside and the good integration with EvoHome. Have you had any issues getting it serviced? Only reason I ask is that Intergas are much less common than the "big boys" and from my (admittedly quite limited) research, it seems there are nowhere near as many Intergas-approved plumbers near me.

            Comment

            • paulockenden
              Automated Home Legend
              • Apr 2015
              • 1719

              #7
              No trouble at all with servicing.

              Comment

              • mtmcgavock
                Automated Home Legend
                • Mar 2017
                • 507

                #8
                Vaillant Green IQ, 1:10 modulation range. No opentherm, but the modulation range makes it great for EvoHome. I'm told by some Vaillant Senior engineers it'll even modulate down more than the 1:10 ratio, whether this is correct or not is another question.

                Not 100% sold on Opentherm, yes it's good but I don't really see much energy savings by using it in the majority of the households in the UK.

                Comment

                • paulockenden
                  Automated Home Legend
                  • Apr 2015
                  • 1719

                  #9
                  Surely to make the most of a wide modulation range you NEED opentherm?

                  That way the controller can set the boiler to a lower temp, rather than just pulsing it on and off at full blast like TPI does.

                  Comment

                  • mtmcgavock
                    Automated Home Legend
                    • Mar 2017
                    • 507

                    #10
                    Not really, Opentherm is a flow temperature set point. If your boiler only has a 1:4 modulation range, in some cases (on a 20kw output) it’ll only modulate down to 5kw (or if 1:6, 3.3kw) if your system is only calling for heat at one or two radiators or heat demand it can’t modulate down low enough at which point it’ll just cycle On and off whether the temperature is 40 or 75oc. If anything it’ll be worse with a lower flow temperature set point.

                    A boiler with a good modulation range with TPI, IMO is just as good as a boiler with opentherm and poor modulation range. It’ll self modulate to the demand on the system at that current time, the only difference is you’ll set the flow temperature on the boiler yourself.

                    But yes you are correct, if you want to use Opentherm you need a boiler with the biggest modulation range possible to make the most of it.

                    I’m all for energy saving but in reality I don’t think here in the UK Opentherm adds much to the savings, if any.

                    Comment

                    • paulockenden
                      Automated Home Legend
                      • Apr 2015
                      • 1719

                      #11
                      In the case of very low demand, where I agree the boiler might have to cycle even with opentherm, isn't it better to cycle with a low setpoint than with the boiler going full blast?

                      Not just from a savings point of view - I'm actually thinking more in terms of control and comfort. Rooms with oscillating temps, for example. I used to see that a lot when I used TPI, but not at all now I've gone to Opentherm.

                      Comment

                      • mtmcgavock
                        Automated Home Legend
                        • Mar 2017
                        • 507

                        #12
                        Originally posted by paulockenden View Post
                        In the case of very low demand, where I agree the boiler might have to cycle even with opentherm, isn't it better to cycle with a low setpoint than with the boiler going full blast?

                        Not just from a savings point of view - I'm actually thinking more in terms of control and comfort. Rooms with oscillating temps, for example. I used to see that a lot when I used TPI, but not at all now I've gone to Opentherm.
                        Not really no, as the boiler won't be able to modulate down enough to achieve that lower temperature and stay there. Of course this will happen if you've only got demand on a few radiators, if your full system is calling for heat then your boiler will modulate accordingly.

                        You've jumped from TPI on an old non-modulating boiler to Opentherm on a boiler that modulates - yes I'd expect you'd see some gain in comfort levels as your old boiler would have just cycled rather than modulated. I suspect if you used TPI on your new boiler you wouldn't notice much difference if any in comfort levels - throw in the fact that Evohome requests 100% heat demand from any zone 1.5oc of the set point you could actually argue that other zones requesting small amounts of heat might actually overshoot.

                        I'm actually running an old non condensing non modulating boiler with TPI and don't experience any issues with comfort levels or overshoots - apart from when the system is relearning (Had an issue with a TRV playing up that'd i'd corrected).

                        Comment

                        • paulockenden
                          Automated Home Legend
                          • Apr 2015
                          • 1719

                          #13
                          I didn’t have comfort issues as such before jumping to Opentherm. Most of what I could see was on graphs, rather than 'real world'. But then with OT I realised there was a change. Not as big as the change when going from old-school to Evohome, but a change nevertheless.

                          Comment

                          • G4RHL
                            Automated Home Legend
                            • Jan 2015
                            • 1580

                            #14
                            I will still go with Intergas when the time comes to replace. My service engineer, former installer, has for some years recommended them even though he says it affects his business as he gets fewer call outs. Currently he keeps telling me to stick with my current 22 year old boiler as it works and is obviously more economical than changing.

                            Comment

                            • mtmcgavock
                              Automated Home Legend
                              • Mar 2017
                              • 507

                              #15
                              Originally posted by G4RHL View Post
                              I will still go with Intergas when the time comes to replace. My service engineer, former installer, has for some years recommended them even though he says it affects his business as he gets fewer call outs. Currently he keeps telling me to stick with my current 22 year old boiler as it works and is obviously more economical than changing.
                              I'd stick with your 22 year old boiler too!

                              Comment

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