An Alternative Perspective

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  • benwillcox
    Automated Home Jr Member
    • Apr 2020
    • 32

    #16
    Originally posted by DBMandrake View Post
    Just set a continous override to something like 10C in the guest room zone. It will be overridden by the heating off action but will go back to the continous override temperature when the system is turned back on.
    Ah yes that does have the same desired effect, thank you.



    Yes, a zone is something that can be uniquely scheduled and controlled. Usually a single room, but there is a special "multi-room zone" zone type that can be configured which applies the same schedule to multiple rooms.
    Thanks for the detailed explanation, it makes sense for things like a downstairs hallway/upstairs landing to be a multi-room zone as the temperature differential between the two sensors will be quite high.
    It almost seems like there should be another mode, like multi-room zone but that allows either HR92 to adjust the set temperature and mirror that to the other HR92s. Or to average the reading between multiple sensors in a single-room zone. In reality I doubt I'll be using the manual control on the HR92 anyway so doesn't really matter.


    As far as we know field / over the air firmware upgrades for the HR92 (and all devices apart from the Evotouch controller itself) are not possible unfortunately. Also the HR92's LCD screen is not a bitmap screen - it's a fixed symbol screen like an LCD watch with the lower line designed for letters - there's no guarentee that it has the necessary symbol segments to be able to display a temperature at the bottom. (But even if it could, the lack of any firmware updates is a show stopper - there have been no HR92 firmware revisions for the last 5 years)
    I did notice that I think there is a USB socket underneath a cap on the HR92 so maybe firmware updates aren't out of the question. The lower line on the display is a multicharacter 11 segment display so more than capable of displaying temperature, albeit without the 'degrees' symbol. Something like '20C' would be fine.

    Comment

    • bruce_miranda
      Automated Home Legend
      • Jul 2014
      • 2307

      #17
      There is a USB socket on the previous generations of Evohome control panels too, but the firmware has never been officially updated on those either. The only devices that have actually received any firmware update has been the Internet Gateway and the WiFi controller.
      So I would say the chances of seeing a firmware update on anything else is the square root of 0.

      Comment

      • DBMandrake
        Automated Home Legend
        • Sep 2014
        • 2361

        #18
        Originally posted by benwillcox View Post
        e is a USB socket underneath a cap on the HR92 so maybe firmware updates aren't out of the question. The lower line on the display is a multicharacter 11 segment display so more than capable of displaying temperature, albeit without the 'degrees' symbol. Something like '20C' would be fine.
        It's not a USB socket, it's a connector for connecting a physical "window open" switch.

        This allows the window open function to be activated by something like a reed switch when a window is physically opened instead of relying on temperature drop heuristics to detect a window (or door) left open. It's documented in the HR92 installation manual and is enabled through one of the window settings in the HR92 settings menu.

        I don't know of anyone who is using this feature though or whether the companion sensor is readily available! (Although as it's just a switch you could make your own if you have the right connector - I think it might actually be a micro-USB connector but it is definitely not USB signalling)
        Last edited by DBMandrake; 14 April 2020, 11:35 AM.

        Comment

        • CT1
          Automated Home Guru
          • Apr 2016
          • 189

          #19
          I have been going through the irritating process of trying to get the batteries in the controller to accept a full charge. Something that I do not think the user should be expected to do. As part of this and to check it has worked, I have had the controller off the wall for some time and have taken the opertunity to see if the location has any affect on the loss of comms with the HW sensor. I have been unable to force a loss of comms, no matter where I place the controller in relation to the tank and pipework. It does not therefore look as though this is the cause of my occasional loss of comms. Maybe the sun spot hypothesis needs further investigation.

          Comment

          • benwillcox
            Automated Home Jr Member
            • Apr 2020
            • 32

            #20
            Originally posted by DBMandrake View Post
            It's not a USB socket, it's a connector for connecting a physical "window open" switch.
            Ah yes I do recall seeing that in the manual now you mention it. Ah well, I'll forget any idea of future firmware updates then!

            Nobody else finding that the maximum of 12 zones is limiting, if wanting to go for a one zone per room approach?

            Comment

            • G4RHL
              Automated Home Legend
              • Jan 2015
              • 1580

              #21
              Originally posted by CT1 View Post
              I have been going through the irritating process of trying to get the batteries in the controller to accept a full charge. Something that I do not think the user should be expected to do. As part of this and to check it has worked, I have had the controller off the wall for some time and have taken the opertunity to see if the location has any affect on the loss of comms with the HW sensor. I have been unable to force a loss of comms, no matter where I place the controller in relation to the tank and pipework. It does not therefore look as though this is the cause of my occasional loss of comms. Maybe the sun spot hypothesis needs further investigation.
              Aye, but the problem with the hypothesis is it affects long wave and short wave frequencies more and not so much VHF, UHF and microwave frequencies which is up where we are with this sort of gear. After 5.5 years I have not had a battery issue with the HR92s, nor really with the HW sensor, other than one HR92 needing its batteries changing every three months. I suspect the circuitry is faulty and not reading the amount of residual power in the batteries correctly as the batteries are fine when I take them out. Put another way, after three months the power drop, albeit slight, is enough for the HR92 to think the batteries need replacing when they don’t. Where I have had an issue is the control panel. In the early days they often showed little or no power. Minor bending of the contacts resolved that but they don’t hold their power for very long when you discount mains power from the panel.15 minutes if one is lucky and then, if not before then, it bleeps and shows little power left. I have not got round to replacing them with new rechargeables. I ought to.

              Comment

              • DBMandrake
                Automated Home Legend
                • Sep 2014
                • 2361

                #22
                Originally posted by benwillcox View Post
                Ah yes I do recall seeing that in the manual now you mention it. Ah well, I'll forget any idea of future firmware updates then!

                Nobody else finding that the maximum of 12 zones is limiting, if wanting to go for a one zone per room approach?
                Not me, I only have 8 rooms!

                Comment

                • DBMandrake
                  Automated Home Legend
                  • Sep 2014
                  • 2361

                  #23
                  Originally posted by G4RHL View Post
                  Aye, but the problem with the hypothesis is it affects long wave and short wave frequencies more and not so much VHF, UHF and microwave frequencies which is up where we are with this sort of gear. After 5.5 years I have not had a battery issue with the HR92s, nor really with the HW sensor, other than one HR92 needing its batteries changing every three months. I suspect the circuitry is faulty and not reading the amount of residual power in the batteries correctly as the batteries are fine when I take them out. Put another way, after three months the power drop, albeit slight, is enough for the HR92 to think the batteries need replacing when they don’t. Where I have had an issue is the control panel. In the early days they often showed little or no power. Minor bending of the contacts resolved that but they don’t hold their power for very long when you discount mains power from the panel.15 minutes if one is lucky and then, if not before then, it bleeps and shows little power left. I have not got round to replacing them with new rechargeables. I ought to.
                  Has anyone running the current beta firmware experienced a hot water comms issue since updating to the beta ?

                  Comment

                  • filbert
                    Automated Home Guru
                    • Oct 2017
                    • 161

                    #24
                    Originally posted by benwillcox View Post
                    Nobody else finding that the maximum of 12 zones is limiting, if wanting to go for a one zone per room approach?
                    I'm bumping my head against it with 12 zones, one per room. I did want to add another at one point but, for the life of me, I can't remember why.

                    Comment

                    • CT1
                      Automated Home Guru
                      • Apr 2016
                      • 189

                      #25
                      Originally posted by G4RHL View Post
                      Aye, but the problem with the hypothesis is it affects long wave and short wave frequencies more and not so much VHF, UHF and microwave frequencies which is up where we are with this sort of gear. After 5.5 years I have not had a battery issue with the HR92s, nor really with the HW sensor, other than one HR92 needing its batteries changing every three months. I suspect the circuitry is faulty and not reading the amount of residual power in the batteries correctly as the batteries are fine when I take them out. Put another way, after three months the power drop, albeit slight, is enough for the HR92 to think the batteries need replacing when they don’t. Where I have had an issue is the control panel. In the early days they often showed little or no power. Minor bending of the contacts resolved that but they don’t hold their power for very long when you discount mains power from the panel.15 minutes if one is lucky and then, if not before then, it bleeps and shows little power left. I have not got round to replacing them with new rechargeables. I ought to.
                      Batteries back to full charge. Just find it irritating that a product at this price and at least 3 generations in, requires undocumented, fiddly work arounds for something as simple as battery charging and battery contacts. The system is complicated enough for the nontechnical user as it is. When I ended up in hospital for 6 weeks 3 years ago my wife had the HR92 swapped out for the old TRVs and reverted to a dumb system. I doubt that EvoHome will ever be suitable for the nontechnical user. Not one of my friends or family have ever been tempted to adopt it and I usually have to help boiler service engineers with basic functions to enable them to test the boiler. If I did not need the totally independant zone control, I would not bother with EvoHome, and if I was not around, my wife would have it ripped out a.s.a.p.

                      If the sunspot hypothesis is out, maybe need to investigate quasars and quantum instability to explain the HW comms. There again it could be a suboptimal design?

                      Comment

                      • G4RHL
                        Automated Home Legend
                        • Jan 2015
                        • 1580

                        #26
                        Originally posted by DBMandrake View Post
                        Has anyone running the current beta firmware experienced a hot water comms issue since updating to the beta ?
                        Good point perhaps somebody running the beta version can advise.

                        Comment

                        • killa47
                          Automated Home Guru
                          • Jan 2016
                          • 123

                          #27
                          Originally posted by CT1 View Post
                          Just find it irritating that a product at this price and at least 3 generations in, requires undocumented, fiddly work arounds for something as simple as battery charging and battery contacts. The system is complicated enough for the nontechnical user as it is. When I ended up in hospital for 6 weeks 3 years ago my wife had the HR92 swapped out for the old TRVs and reverted to a dumb system. I doubt that EvoHome will ever be suitable for the nontechnical user. Not one of my friends or family have ever been tempted to adopt it and I usually have to help boiler service engineers with basic functions to enable them to test the boiler. If I did not need the totally independant zone control, I would not bother with EvoHome, and if I was not around, my wife would have it ripped out a.s.a.p.

                          If the sunspot hypothesis is out, maybe need to investigate quasars and quantum instability to explain the HW comms. There again it could be a suboptimal design?
                          All points well said, CT1. I think there's lots of Evohome users on your wavelength here.

                          Comment

                          • smar
                            Automated Home Sr Member
                            • Feb 2018
                            • 57

                            #28
                            Originally posted by DBMandrake View Post
                            Has anyone running the current beta firmware experienced a hot water comms issue since updating to the beta ?
                            Originally posted by G4RHL View Post
                            Good point perhaps somebody running the beta version can advise.
                            Yes, I'm still getting them. Last one was two days ago.

                            Comment

                            • smar
                              Automated Home Sr Member
                              • Feb 2018
                              • 57

                              #29
                              Originally posted by benwillcox View Post
                              Ah yes I do recall seeing that in the manual now you mention it. Ah well, I'll forget any idea of future firmware updates then!

                              Nobody else finding that the maximum of 12 zones is limiting, if wanting to go for a one zone per room approach?
                              Yes, I've found it a bit limiting as well. 16 or more would have been perfect.

                              Comment

                              • benwillcox
                                Automated Home Jr Member
                                • Apr 2020
                                • 32

                                #30
                                Originally posted by smar View Post
                                Yes, I've found it a bit limiting as well. 16 or more would have been perfect.
                                Thanks, sounds like there are a few of us thinking the same.
                                I can't see that the limit is due to technical reasons such as RF channels and device IDs etc, as there is the ability to bind more rooms/HR92 etc than there are zones. So it seems like the limit of 12 is just an arbitrary number that was decided at some point in development.
                                I think lots of houses would be close to or over the 12 room/zone limit, and personally I prefer it when software limitations like this are well above what would be 'average' use cases.
                                Upping it to 24 I think would cover all but the largest mansions, UI changes would be easy as it's just a couple more pages of 6.

                                Comment

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