Monitoring external systems - a solution

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  • mcockerell
    Automated Home Sr Member
    • Jan 2009
    • 74

    Monitoring external systems - a solution

    For some time I having been looking for a way to interface 3rd party systems into Idratek to allow me to monitor the operation of the heating, cooling and ventilation systems in the house (and ultimately control them better) and I came across a small chip that seemed ideal for the job - the HCPL-3700, which is described as an AC/DC to Logic Interface Optocoupler.

    Karam kindly provided me with the specification for a typical Idratek digital input and earlier this week I finally found time to make up my first prototype - see photo below. My initial requirement is to monitor AC mains feeds, but as you will see very few components are required (just 2 resistors and a capacitor) as the IC takes care of most things. For a DC version just 2 resistors are needed (no filter capacitor required) - in both versions the resistors determine the voltage trigger level, which in the prototype I set to approximately 160V RMS.

    Yesterday afternoon I hooked it up to a spare input on an Idratek module for the first time and am pleased to say that it works perfectly. I powered it from the nominal 12V Idranet supply, so it actually only needs 3 connectons on the low voltage side - Gnd, +12V, Output->Digital input.

    I now plan to build a set of these; at the moment I have 3 circuits to monitor, all AC mains (solar pump, brine pump, boiler enable). Each will be mounted in a small plastic box close to my main Idratek panels, with 2-core mains cable running back to the circuits to be monitored. For anyone that is interested the component cost of a single unit is around £6.50; the chip, capacitor and high-spec resistors make up £3.95 of this and the connectors, board and box account for the rest - I obtained everything from RS.

    I hope that this is of interest to others - if it is I can recommend the application notes for the device.

    Martin
    Attached Files
  • chris_j_hunter
    Automated Home Legend
    • Dec 2007
    • 1713

    #2
    well done ... wonder if getting the supply voltage down to say 5V would be OK & save significant power consumption over time, perhaps using the spare pair of the Idranet Cat-5e cable ?

    Chris

    NB: best we'd done, in looking for something like this, were some of the Arduino & PicAxe project boards, or maybe something from Cebek & Velleman - all of which would have been overkill, and much more complicated / expensive / power-consuming !
    Last edited by chris_j_hunter; 7 March 2010, 05:34 PM. Reason: typo's
    Our self-build - going further with HA...

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    • mcockerell
      Automated Home Sr Member
      • Jan 2009
      • 74

      #3
      I did consider running off 5V, or even 3.3V, but the IC is rated for a maximum supply voltage of 18V and the data sheet states a maximum supply current of just 4mA so this seemed to be adding unnecessary complexity - it might be worth considering if there were a whole bank of them mounted together. I've just checked my prototype and it draws just 2.5mA when active (mains applied) and no measurable current (< 1uA) when inactive, so it consumes less than 40mW (given that the nominal 12V supply voltage is around 15V).

      Martin

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      • chris_j_hunter
        Automated Home Legend
        • Dec 2007
        • 1713

        #4
        great, many thanks ...

        Chris


        BTW, found the maker's datasheet quite easily, but had a bit of trouble finding a useful applications sheet (that could help me choose component values etc) - best I found were these :


        Last edited by chris_j_hunter; 7 March 2010, 12:51 PM.
        Our self-build - going further with HA...

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        • Paul_B
          Automated Home Legend
          • Jul 2006
          • 608

          #5
          M****erell,

          This looks very interesting. But as I'm a noobie when it comes to electronics what are you monitoring and how is this displayed in Cortex?

          Comment

          • mcockerell
            Automated Home Sr Member
            • Jan 2009
            • 74

            #6
            Originally posted by chris_j_hunter View Post
            BTW, found the maker's datasheet quite easily, but had a bit of trouble finding a useful applications sheet (that could help me choose component values etc)
            Here is a link to the original manufacturer's website for the datasheet and application notes - the one that I found most useful is AN-1004 which explains the principles and helps choose values for the components. For mains sensing I used a pair of 27K 2W resistors and a 22uF 16V electrolytic.

            The HCPL-3700 is a voltage/current threshold detection optocoupler for use in AC-to-DC logic interface and Intelligent Power Module (IPM) applications.


            Hope this helps.

            Martin
            Last edited by mcockerell; 7 March 2010, 05:28 PM.

            Comment

            • mcockerell
              Automated Home Sr Member
              • Jan 2009
              • 74

              #7
              Originally posted by Paul_B View Post
              This looks very interesting. But as I'm a noobie when it comes to electronics what are you monitoring and how is this displayed in Cortex?
              I'm monitoring, for example, when the pump in the solar heating system is switched on; the most direct way of achieving this is to measure the voltage across the pump itself - no voltage = off, full mains voltage = on. The output from the sensing circuit is high when no voltage detected, pulled low when the threshold voltage level has been exceeded. The output is connected directly to a digital input on an Idratek module and can be used in the same way as any other digital input in Cortex, for example a switch that takes a digital input to 0V when it is closed. At present I am simply using Cortex to log when each of the external sytems is activated so that I can observe how the various systems are interacting - I am considering using the LEDs on a QBI to show the state of those that I am particularly interested in.

              Martin

              Comment

              • chris_j_hunter
                Automated Home Legend
                • Dec 2007
                • 1713

                #8
                ah, that's better, thanks ...

                Chris
                Our self-build - going further with HA...

                Comment

                • chris_j_hunter
                  Automated Home Legend
                  • Dec 2007
                  • 1713

                  #9
                  wonder if Karam's tempted to add this trick / device to update an existing module, or even maybe create a new module with it - it's very simple & there might be many uses ! ?
                  Our self-build - going further with HA...

                  Comment

                  • Paul_B
                    Automated Home Legend
                    • Jul 2006
                    • 608

                    #10
                    It's all very quiet on the Idratek / Cortex front atm. Next big thing must be a new version of Cortex the current version has been around for over a year now

                    Comment

                    • chris_j_hunter
                      Automated Home Legend
                      • Dec 2007
                      • 1713

                      #11
                      'certainly is ... perhaps Cortex v25 with added features & maybe compatibility with 'Vista (ouch) & Windows 7 (ouch) and/or Mac (!), and perhaps interfacing with iPhone / iPod touch / iPad ... plus maybe some of those modules previously mentioned, as being on the way, some time back ... hmm, we can dream !

                      Chris
                      Last edited by chris_j_hunter; 7 March 2010, 10:16 PM.
                      Our self-build - going further with HA...

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                      • Karam
                        Automated Home Legend
                        • Mar 2005
                        • 863

                        #12
                        Perhaps perversely we have been a bit caught out by the rate of increase of business in the last year rather than the other way around, so development projects have been taking a lower priority whilst we try and adjust ourselves elsewhere.

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                        • chris_j_hunter
                          Automated Home Legend
                          • Dec 2007
                          • 1713

                          #13
                          Martin -

                          wondered if you had anything new on this ... updates / enhancements / applications / ways of incorporating them into CUs ... ?

                          it still looks good for many situations, vis-a-vis alternatives - which seem to be these :





                          Chris
                          Last edited by chris_j_hunter; 15 October 2010, 09:51 AM. Reason: new not now !
                          Our self-build - going further with HA...

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                          • Paul_B
                            Automated Home Legend
                            • Jul 2006
                            • 608

                            #14
                            I think it was Otto who Twitted about the Current Cost Individual Appliance Monitors appearing on Amazon:

                            Current Cost IAMs on Amazon

                            Not a lot of details though but wonder if these could be used via xPL or xAP into Cortex?

                            Comment

                            • chris_j_hunter
                              Automated Home Legend
                              • Dec 2007
                              • 1713

                              #15
                              yep, 'noticed SP's note about them on ukha_d ... 'though current without voltage has limitations & linking CC into Cortex could be tricky ...

                              wonder how accurately the trigger voltage or current could be set on Martin's device ?

                              and if we could use a current clamp & a known load (that we could check, say, with a multimeter, perhaps yearly) to determine mains voltage (eg: Cortex could switch it on now & then & take a reading) ?
                              Our self-build - going further with HA...

                              Comment

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